So I spent my summer in an illegal tank (OC)

Jan 5, 2017 1:30 PM

MartinGrahovski

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439601

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11525

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400

The man you see in front of you is Dinko Valev:

TLDR:
1) He is a famous vigilante who illegally patrols the Bulgarian border where he apprehends migrants.
2) I spent a portion of my summer in his tank alongside him writing an article.
3) There are many more like Valev with varying degrees of notoriety.
4) I'm going back today to work on an YouTube series about vigilante justice in Bulgaria. 5) I'm hoping IMGUR would like to follow my story as it unfolds.

FYI You can read all you want about Valev and what exactly he's done here:

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35919068
https://www.vice.com/en_au/article/migrant-hell-v23n4
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/apr/12/bulgaria-arrests-three-vigilantes-accused-migrant-attacks

This is him demonstrating for me how one squishes a bus should one feel the need to.

Outside of Valev, I examined the rise of vigilante force around the country including civilian military groups like the one pictured above. (I made a promise not to film any faces except for the main leaders so that is why the focus is mostly on torso / arms in the shots above.)

I also got to interview Petar Nizamov - another vigilante who you might know from videos such as the one below.

At some point this was pretty much all that was being published about Bulgaria. This smart phone video circulated showing migrants that Nizamov had apparently apprehended and zip tied while waiting for border police to show up.

During the summer, I was working on an articlefor a program co-ordinated through Reuters, CNN, the Washington Post, and a bunch of other media corps. It was an amazing experience but a difficult one.
I could talk for ages about how split my opinion is on everything going on within the country and what the most recent developments in hostilities between migrants and the police could mean for public perception and so on but if you're looking for additional info from me, please read my article that I uploaded back in September:

https://journey2016.atavist.com/vigilante-justice-bulgaria

NOW WHY AM I TELLING YOU ALL THIS?

In 1 hour I am leaving for a flight to go back to Bulgaria and work on proper independent media coverage of vigilante's within the country as well as the current situation for migrants.

I want IMGUR to be a part of this.

It's not about having views on YouTube or subscribers, it's about having an audience that is interested in what I'm doing over the next 18 days.

I have previously made it to the front page for my "Winter in Japan" video and I received an incredible amount of feedback and comments which made it all SO WORTHWHILE. It was inspiring to have so many of you ask me simple things like what equiptment I recommend or what my ideal itinerary would be.

If anyone is interested the link is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxamZiDlJ0A.

Although I am very happy with my travel video(s), this project is something far more ambitious and driven from my own desire to tell the story from an unbiased perspective as possible.

STARTING TOMORROW I WILL BE WORKING ON "THE VIGILANTE DIARIES".

You can follow it on my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWQsjHZCRqinkfLWn7DP8pg

I don't want donations or anything of the sort, just an audience that will hopefully interact with what I upload over the next 2 weeks.
THE INTRO VIDEO: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZ_0DCW1iI

EDIT 1: First Episode is up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtcPGbNsXSc

EDIT 2: Second Episode is up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H92rNdA5P1A

PS: For anyone wondering - I've been running a freelance media / photo company alongside my best friend for the last three working on documentaries for a few big international organizations such as Oxfam and WWF. This is strictly a personal project and I don't want it to be tied to anyone.

interesting!! i'll be tuned. fact is ambiguous EU policy is leading people to improvisation in both sides, pro/against

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

I read "migrants" as "midgets" at first and was very confused.

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 0

On one hand I don't believe you're a journalist ('s plural. Really?), but then you called that a tank (sensationalist), so now I'm confused.

9 years ago | Likes 14 Dislikes 1

Can you infiltrate Vice and report on why they suck now?

9 years ago | Likes 13 Dislikes 5

Do they suck, or do they just say stuff you disagree with?

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 4

They make docs on men who fuck donkeys...

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 3

Well I'm sorry that your private life was put on display like that.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 6

I am very interested. We need more real journalism like this

9 years ago | Likes 1013 Dislikes 18

I hate how people say sth like this is real journalism. He also has his agenda. His work is interesting but he will also push his agenda.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Bring back the ism in journalism!

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

MOOAARR

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

While not all of it will be, look in to viceland or just vice in general

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

This is what vice was like about 10-15 years ago. Gonzo vigilante journalism. Now its just fucking drivel.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Growing up I always wanted to travel and be a journalist, but it died out or so I thought. So I totally agree we need this back!

9 years ago | Likes 19 Dislikes 0

I would love living like this but unfortunately I'm way too biased to ever be a respectable journalist.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 0

I mean there are different kinds of journalists, I wanted to be a photo journalist & travel the world and meet people and know their stories

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

There is a tremendous amount of "real" journalism. To deny this is do a disservice to so many who risk their lives to bring the world to 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 0

2/2 us. As much as one may want to argue the business of news prevents "real" journalism, ultimately the readership dictates the product.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 0

Gonzo journalism best journalism.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

I feel like they're abusing power on helpless people. Illegal immigrants or not you can't enforce the law by breaking it. They are psychos.

9 years ago | Likes 171 Dislikes 46

But yet they can.

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 14

Lotta people are just looking for an excuse to hurt someone else and get away with it.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

Disorder is not the solution. Be careful with those people out there OP. Hope you give an honest opinion on these people.

9 years ago | Likes 35 Dislikes 4

I may not agree with who's doing or how they do it, but I don't think refugees should be coming into a country illegally.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

If you chase people with a fucking tank you're not doing any good at all. Let the goverment handel them.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

That's kinda what I'm getting at

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

That's not a damn tank. Learn what the words you use mean.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Next, go to Syria and find out why they're leaving the country.

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 2

15% of them are come from Syria.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Are they migrants or refugees? Big difference here. Good journalism though.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Bring it bro, bitches need to be informed :-)

9 years ago | Likes 335 Dislikes 23

That's right, as the man said "the bitches need to be edumacated! Bring the noise, OP!" ;)

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

Bitches love to be educated.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 0

Haha that they do :)

9 years ago | Likes 73 Dislikes 2

I'm curious as to what motivated these people to start this?

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

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9 years ago (deleted Jan 6, 2017 3:38 PM) | Likes 0 Dislikes 0

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9 years ago (deleted Jan 6, 2017 2:49 PM) | Likes 0 Dislikes 0

While the average pension for the elderly is around 120 euros and an average salary is around 400 euros.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

But in all seriousness, sounds like an interesting gig, keep us posted!

9 years ago | Likes 21 Dislikes 2

If this gets to the front page I'll make sure to edit the post and all the different episodes!

9 years ago | Likes 17 Dislikes 1

Excellent, will spread the word.

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 2

You should make this into a podcast series.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

"independent media" in Bulgaria :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D.... There is no such thing

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

To be clear that isn't a tank, it's a tracked utility vehicle

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Not tank. Amphibious transport vehicle, very lightly armoured... closer to Halftrack (Just fully tracked and can go in the water)

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Why do people think every armored vehicle is a tank? Jesus, do some research.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 2

This thing isn't even armored either.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

This is very important, thanks for sharing!

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Tanks* for sharing

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

This whole thread of people jumping to conclusions about these people is why we need someone doing actual journalism and getting more info

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 4

That's not a tank. I don't trust journalists that can't even be bothered to do research.

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 2

it'd be REALLY fucking cool if you traveled to syria too and get to know them in the same way and travel through bulgaria with them.

9 years ago | Likes 15 Dislikes 7

why downvote? he's saying he wants an unbiased perspective, visiting both involved sites and ppl seems like a pretty good way to do that no?

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 2

There's no such thing as an unbiased perspective, there are only various forms of bias. It's about filtering info through known bias.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

absolutely, i agree, OP called it that unbiased perspective. i would have written "unbiased perspective" if i had characters to spare. ;)

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

I think the point is he's gathering info from a perspective no one else is willing to. Plenty have done from the Syrian perspective honestly

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

that's not what i read into it, i read into it that he is insinuating that news outlets are conveying a ambiguous (biased) view.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

ambiguous in the sense that choice of news outlet gives different views.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Not saying one way is right, only saying attacking him for not doing it the way you and everyone else think is right is misguided

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

who is attacking him?! i havent said anything about ONE way, he is looking for an unbiased view, looking at BOTH sides is the logical step.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

fuck illegal migrants.

9 years ago | Likes 13 Dislikes 4

nah man, fuck you

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 8

Surprising number of people making sweeping statements about people's motivations & economic situations without any evidence. 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 16 Dislikes 7

More and more posts on imgur seem to be alt-right/fascist propaganda from emotional/angry teenagers. 2/2

9 years ago | Likes 19 Dislikes 10

Sadly its not only imgur. Alt-right (or however you want to call them) are on the rise in europe (and elsewhere in the world)

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 4

Imgur is alt-right/fascist? Hahaha don't make me laugh. It's one of the most leftist naive sites on the web

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

OP, this is fascinating, please share more. I would interested in knowing why the migrants are not welcome there; is it because they are 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 3

Because every country has a right to control its borders and immigration... you want to emigrate, follow the laws & procedures.

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 7

Causing "trouble" and breaking local laws or it more of nationalism that is fuelling this? Please share, we rarely hear about this. 2/2

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 3

Why is the word trouble in quotes? Do you know the history of Bulgaria or seen the Einzelfall map?

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 2

The migrants are most likely just trying to pass through on their way to Germany, the UK or Sweden.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

I support you getting the full story. But I can't tell if you're actually doing an exposé or a glorification. Please clarify

9 years ago | Likes 74 Dislikes 14

What is glorifying about his post? Theres vigilantes in Bulgaria stopping migrants/refugees. One of the vigilantes has a tank. He's filming.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 4

He uses the words "apprehended" and "Vigilante justice". I just want to know if he agrees with it or not

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 2

... especially since those words are usually for criminal activity, and the word "migrant" doesn't mean criminal.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Telling the full story would require travelling with refugees too.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 0

Nah but why would anyone do that right? All the dirty immigrants are just subhumans right? They don't have a story either right?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Does it matter? He is showing what is happening. It doesn't matter his own feelings

9 years ago | Likes 21 Dislikes 17

this is scary. No one leaves their homes or family behind unless they need too and here we have horrible people thinking they are justice.

9 years ago | Likes 14 Dislikes 13

Why are they horrible people? I respect what they are trying to do, its perfectly understandable

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 5

To go out of your way with guns pretending you are justice? Fuck no. This are people not animals

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Perhaps these people should fight for their homelands rather than deserting them like rats; we Europeans have done this for centuries.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 2

Hahaha you mean the same europeans that colonize the world because they immigrated everywhere? At least this immigrants don't go killing

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Defended yourselves while proudly crying "never give up! Never surrender!" There was never a time were basically the entire continent was 2

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Sending boats upon boats of people across the ocean or to neighboring countries that had somehow escaped the tyrannical will of a madman?3/4

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Oh, you have? You've never sought outside help when your people were being rounded up and slaughtered en mass? You have always proudly 1

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

I've never needed to seek outside help because my forefathers killed every nigger that tried to enslave them.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 2

Really, Mr European? That is super not what I'm talking about. Where are you from, if you don't mind my asking?

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

But if you'd like to give a couple examples I'd be willing to talk about it. 2/2

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Regardless of what that other guy's said, in recent centuries Europeans haven't fled in the mass numbers that Syrians are right now 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

These people are not heroes, they are thugs.

9 years ago | Likes 42 Dislikes 15

Same can be said about the people they are stopping/apprehending. It's all perspective and the Imgur hivemid one tend to be leaning left

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

How are people running away from a war and trying to get to a place that they can live safely and support their families thugs?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

1 Most of them are not running away from wars. Turkey is not in any wars, why dont they stay there? Why do they travel trough

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Most of them are not Turks. most are Syrians or Iraqis or afghans or Libyans, you know places with wars.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

AS for why not stop in Turkey, being able to work for a living is important. Turkey could not possibly support that many people.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Read again, I never said they were Turks I said they enter from Turkey.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

2 20 perfectly safe countries just to reach the ones that give most money to them

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

i find it slightly ironic that bulgarians dislike immigrants when there has been a mass exodus of bulgarians to more western euro countries

9 years ago | Likes 398 Dislikes 38

Countries consist of many individuals with different opinions and values.

9 years ago | Likes 45 Dislikes 2

they dislike ILLEGAL immigrants. Big difference

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 3

Dailymail?

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

The majority of the bulgarians that has migrated are the gypsys and they differ generally from the rest of the country

9 years ago | Likes 17 Dislikes 4

Really the gypsies? Big tattooed bro patrolling the border for illegal immigrants. Whee is there no meme for this?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

I haven't seen massive hordes of rioting Bulgarians.

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 1

How many of those Bulgarians have blown themselves up in suicide bombings? I'd like an exact number please. I'll wait while you find it.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 7

considering no refugees have blown themselves up in bulgaria that i'm aware of, i'm not sure what your point is.

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 1

oh, btw, bulgaria is immensely happy to sell arms to anyone + everyone, caches of which were found in aleppo recently. reap what you sow?

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 1

Bulgarians are part of the Europian union, and as such, they have every right to travel work and study in Europe.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 2

yes, they do. you are absolutely right. it still doesn't change the irony of it though

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 2

btw, i'm all for border controls, but not by self appointed vigilantes, many(not all) of whom have strong racist/fascist tendencies

9 years ago | Likes 301 Dislikes 19

Yesss this!

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

THANK YOU

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 3

There would be no need for vigilantes if the appropriate authorities did their job eh?

4 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Well it does say "he apprehends _migrants_" - he hunts emigrants as well. "You want to leave Bulgaria? Haha, no chance my friend."

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

It's a specific type of immigrants they disapprove of, not immigrants or immigration per se.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 4

Syrian(Islamic) culture is not compatible with western values. Looks at the 1000 sexual assault on German women in one day by refugees. 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 9

There is a big diffirence between people who are looking for a job and are trying to be integrated and people who are doing it illegally.

9 years ago | Likes 72 Dislikes 19

Soooo... you want migrants, not refugees?

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Am in GER and see a bunch of Bulgarians in their own quarters running Kebab places pretending to be Turks, ironic bc they hate each other

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 2

Lots of refugees are looking for a job and trying to be integrated (or would be if they had the chance), just saying.

9 years ago | Likes 18 Dislikes 6

The problem comes from the other part of the miggrants. While a small part they are troublesome to deal with. No papers to prove origin.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 3

Its difficult allright, but you don't need papers to have human rights, some people forget this

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

What makes you think that? You really think people travel that far to another country to live a life of homelessness?

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Furthermore many do not try to look for a job and live from the goverment help.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 8

You mean the Bulgarians in the other European countries?

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 0

Ah. The feelings are strong withis one. Ain't no fact gonna budge this dude.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

If you have some facts let me see.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

A little post factual crybaby. Did you not understand a single word I wrote? If you thought facts mattered you'd search them yourself.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

You're happy in your bubble dismissing anything that counters your thoughts as leftist propaganda. They make you feel bad so they're lies!

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

How do you legally flee a war in your home country? Drive to the next airport and book a one way trip to the Bahamas?

9 years ago | Likes 24 Dislikes 11

Most of the migrants causing problems aren't refugees from wars, they're economic migrants who go back once they find it's not paradise.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Most of them aren't fleeing. They see an opportunity to go and live a better life. Better as in not working and getting free stuff from 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 17

the goverment. If you look it up you can buy a Syrian passport and ID. With a new identity. This is how terrorist can sneak in easily.

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 14

You have a point. But really, is there a problem with wanting a better life? As for terrorists... There is no escaping that problem.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Oh pls educate yourself before spewing hate-4,9 million refugees come from Syria alone, and I don't have to tell you why they are fleeing...

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 2

Isis right?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

refugees are required by law to stop at the first safe country. most dont, so from that point they cease being refugees and become migrants.

9 years ago | Likes 15 Dislikes 3

Because neighboring countries are usually so nice to refugees. They even let them have their own camp!

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Yet even if you do, and get eventually assigned to a country further away, you still get yelled at and attacked by "concerned citizens".

9 years ago | Likes 12 Dislikes 2

any assignment is purely down to the courtesy of a receiving country. refugee claims are supposed to be mandatory in 1st safe signee country

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Some of the blame for that might go to the vast amounts of people who didn't play by the rules.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

only by virtue of being allowed into eu about 2 decades too early, + let's be honest, most arriving in bulgaria are only travelling through

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 3

They are indeed. But we have no means to determine what they are going to do. The recent terrorist attackers might have been let trought 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

hey, i already said we needed more secure borders, but that's not some vigilante's job, nor does it take away from the irony

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

People don't support Velev. Well most of them don't. Only people the uneducated or people who remember stories about the Ottoman empire.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Because there was no one to stop them and determine if they should be let through or not.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

The irony is that, throughout much of the rest of Europe, it is the Bulgarian immigrants that people want to get rid of. White slavers.

9 years ago | Likes 25 Dislikes 10

Now you are generalizing. Because a couple of groups are bad according to you, we should exclude rest of the Bulgarian people?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

The people they want to get rid of are the gypsies that try to exploit the richer western european nations the same way they have been/part1

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 4

Exploiting our own country their whole lives, I see no one complaining about the foctors, engineers and IT tevhs that we export to the west

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 1

As a northern European I can't say I've ever seen Bulgarians among the "troublesome nationalities".

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 3

If a person is not going in legally with no papers that prove origin or if they have a record should not be let in. 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 2

If you want to go to another country to seek a better life you should be able to do it. Legally.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 2

Bulgarians only can do it legally because they got a free pass into the EU, despite not meeting the standards. Kinda like Greece.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

So you are saying that most of the people fleeing from for example syria shouldnt be let in to any counties because the smuglers took 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

all of their money and papers?

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

Awarness indeed. Fleeing the war to be captured by a big white bear at the border. Joys of life.

9 years ago | Likes 40 Dislikes 16

So long as they yell "OPEN OR DIE" and assault the border, they can go back to their shithole.

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 1

Barley any of these economic migrants are fleeing war, look up were they are coming from so few come from war torn places.

9 years ago | Likes 23 Dislikes 18

Please go look up some legitimate facts instead of listening to the BS of far right pundits. http://www.unhcr.org/figures-at-a-glance.html

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 1

Doesnt say anything in your link about the demographic of the refugees in Europe.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

You have no idea where they are coming from

9 years ago | Likes 15 Dislikes 11

Refugee status is there to protect victims of war, not economic migrants. Syrian children starve because there are 30 greedy POS inline.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Because they burn their passports/ID cards, why do you think they do that?

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

80% of "Syrian refugees" are from north africa, 70% of them are men, and they seem intent on going through all of Europe to get to Germany.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

what makes you think people would want to run from the security of their home without good reason?

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 3

Why does anyone migrate to a richer country legally or illegaly? They seek a better life but are doing it the wrong way.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

For every fake asylum seeker, that is less food, shelter and services for real victims of war Apparently you enjoy Syrian refugees starving

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

fake asylum seekers? is this a big issue? can you source that? and stop with the moronic straw men, i never said that.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Because if they get to northern Europe they get money they could only dream about otherwise, stop being so naive.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

all my friends that fled from iraq, afganistan, kurdistan had much less money as refugees in sweden than with careers and houses at home.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 2

Ah the "all the refugees that arrive are engineers" trope, nice one.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Yeah. I'd say you are waaaay off there. Most of them are fleeing for their lives.

9 years ago | Likes 16 Dislikes 12

Nope you are way off and ignorant on the subject if you truly believe the majority are from Syria.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

It's a bit hard to believe when they flee past like 10 safe countries, evading border patrol to get to the one they prefer

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 0

80% of "Syrian refugees" are from north africa, 70% of them are men, and they seem intent on going through all of Europe to get to Germany.

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 3

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9 years ago (deleted Feb 27, 2023 9:16 PM) | Likes 0 Dislikes 0

T-thanks, you too

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Vigilantes are out to do good illegally... this isn't vigilante justice, its just a brute with a tank abusing people who have nothing.

9 years ago | Likes 205 Dislikes 68

What's good is relative, so

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

exactly, probably some fascist that enjoys playing soldier.

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 6

YES thank you. It's like the Autodefensas in the Colombian Civil war

9 years ago | Likes 12 Dislikes 10

I thought the Autodefensas was just in Mexico

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Well that's why we need journalism like what op's doing to open informed debate on stuff like this.

9 years ago | Likes 28 Dislikes 3

Unfortunately giving fringe groups like this attention only serves to validate them and normalise their behaviour.

9 years ago | Likes 16 Dislikes 1

Maybe they dont want to be culturally enriched?

9 years ago | Likes 40 Dislikes 21

I don't blame them.

9 years ago | Likes 12 Dislikes 3

Well they'll damn have to if they want to call themselves humane

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Alt-righters are seriously some miserable disgusting garbage people. Can we deport them and keep the Mexicans?

9 years ago | Likes 21 Dislikes 27

Found the SJW

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 25

Being that you're only a citizen due to birthright citizenship, how do you feel about birthright citizenship?

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 2

I feel it should only apply if one or both parents are citizens. It shouldn't just be "oh you plopped out in this country, you're a citizen"

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 3

Ah, you went with SJW. I figured you'd call me a cuck or a snowflake. It's always one of the three.

9 years ago | Likes 13 Dislikes 7

Could say the same about you calling me an alt-righter/xenophobe/islamophobe/racist/sexist or w/e

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 8

2/2 that is why you only see men of working age, they want better jobs and that is not a good enough reason to be an illegal immagrant

9 years ago | Likes 15 Dislikes 13

it is pretty much one of the few reasons people do it, all countries have this, the world economy depends on some illegals coming around

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

You have a valid point, but you ruin it with exaggerations like "nearly all" and "only". 66% of adult migrants / refugees are men, as 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 4

are 90% of unaccompanied minors. The total male/female ratio is around 2:1. There are economic migrants,but also legitimate refugee families

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 4

I feel like wanting a better life is a pretty damn good reason to migrate - it's pretty much why the US exists, at least.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

I found the sjw!

9 years ago | Likes 13 Dislikes 27

Nearly all of these migrants have money, family, homes ect they are going to countries they think they can get more money from. 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 14 Dislikes 26

Not exactly, how much of the Syrian conflict is reported to where you live? Most of these people are refugees of war, and it is often 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 1

2/2 the man who arrives first and then tries to get permission for the rest who the family to come.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

Even if they do, I don't blame them for persuing a better life.

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 1

how do you know that? where are you getting this information from?

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Abusing people by enforcing the law.

9 years ago | Likes 31 Dislikes 33

Abusing people by breaking the law.

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 2

Enforcing the law by breaking it. See the hypocrisy?

9 years ago | Likes 35 Dislikes 3

Which law? In Bulgaria what they are doing is purely illegal.

9 years ago | Likes 31 Dislikes 3

Literally said they waited for border POLICE...

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 21

They do not have the right to detain anyone. Border Police are the ones responsible for this and that's the cold hard truth.

9 years ago | Likes 25 Dislikes 3

Are ILLEGAL migrants protected under that law though?

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 22

Citizens arrest.

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 26

If we did this in the US to the mexicans NOT going through the immigration process we'd be labeled racists and bigots.

9 years ago | Likes 63 Dislikes 27

Don't we call them ICE?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 2

We already have vigilantes who do this in the US to immigrants who don't go through the immigration process. Lots of them.

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 3

Some of us bulgarians think similarly of these vigilantees.

9 years ago | Likes 81 Dislikes 11

Cool, I dont care for trumps "wall" plan, and think better/easier immigration policy would fix our problems over here.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

You're falsely assuming that these vigilantes aren't bigoted ultra-nationalists.

9 years ago | Likes 12 Dislikes 10

I'm not assuming they are anything, I was talking about US border practices and what someone would be if they took the law into their hands.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

I thought you were saying that people in the US doing the same would be wrongfully accused of bigotry, misinterpretation on my end.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 2

I sometimes dont communicate what I mean very well, imgur is a great way to put thoughts into physical form and see how people react. TY!

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Enforcing the US immigration law is already considered racist by he left...

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

well, that is because you would be. so is this shit head.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 2

Yyyyeah, you would be. Or at least, you'd be a shithead. Vigilantes are, overwhelmingly, more harm than they are help.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 3

As well as a liability, what happens if someone gets shot?

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Correctly labeled.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Rightfully so.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 7

There are other motives for border vigilantes besides racism

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Sure, like garden variety sociopathy.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

You'd be a piece of shit for doing it in America, and that guy's a piece of shit for doing it in Bulgaria. Simple concept.

9 years ago | Likes 99 Dislikes 32

No argument there, out imigration process is shit.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Also, we do have volunteer militias "guarding" the border who would love to be more proactive about it if they could get away with it.

9 years ago | Likes 24 Dislikes 7

"If you illegally attacked people because of where they're from, you'd be considered racist" - guy who's unaware that he's describing racism

9 years ago | Likes 29 Dislikes 6

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9 years ago (deleted Jul 16, 2017 2:32 AM) | Likes 0 Dislikes 0

So? If they're violent, punish them. Most of 'em just want better lives.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 6

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9 years ago (deleted Jul 16, 2017 2:32 AM) | Likes 0 Dislikes 0

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9 years ago (deleted Jan 6, 2017 5:37 PM) | Likes 0 Dislikes 0

Immigration enforcement should be left to law enforcement, - who can be held accountable for unmitigated abuses.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 2

And if law enforcement can't handle it we just say oh well?

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 0

No, we vote a lunatic in because he'll build a wall *sarcasm font.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

lol you're already labeled like that in latin america for having that wall up

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 8

So I should be able to just go anywhere without doing any paperwork or apply for visas or pay taxes to your country if i work there?

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 1

YOU ALREADY DO

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 7

Why in the world do you think this?

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

the US military has bases worldwide... us soldiers don't need visas to work in our countries or pay taxes to the countries they are deployed

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 3

As a bulgarian, I strongly disaprove of the actions of these meat-heads I've found that media coverege only helps them further. So fuck them

9 years ago | Likes 546 Dislikes 88

I'm at work at the moment but later I'll respond to your arguments since this can be discussed further.

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 1

OMG :O (check out my name). was just reading the comment and found yours :O tell Beti hello from me :D

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 20

@bearwithhair check out this vid (you maybe have already seen this? this vid was exactly what I was thinking of when I red your response 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 8

exactly! they think they are justice when in fact they are the evil assholes of the world.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 4

they want to protect their country and culture. Maybe you'd like to be like Germany and have 1000 women sexually assaulted in one night.

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 3

Do you want illegal immigrants like in Germany and France? Keep talking shit and you will get them.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 4

Bulgarian vigilantes: tsiulini mi guzza! (Kaksi, bearwithhair!)

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

I'm not sure I fully understand the conflict going on. Could someone explain?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

If nobody else does it, the "meat-heads" will. Whats your solution? and how will you make it happen?

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 10

I'm British and I wholeheartedly agree. These people are, for want of a better term, cunts.

9 years ago | Likes 30 Dislikes 7

Facts and harsh truths always get ignored in the face of emotional manipulation. "We can't turn them away, that would make us bad people."

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 14

Not to mention this is totally shameless self-promotion from OP.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 1

I totally agree with you fellow Bulgar

9 years ago | Likes 66 Dislikes 7

I was just reading the first TLDR point and immediately thought "Dissaprove!"

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 0

And they're not migrants. They're refugees. I hate that people call them migrants, it minimizes the crisis they're escaping from.

9 years ago | Likes 114 Dislikes 54

They are migrants, not refugees. stop calling these ***** refugees.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 7

So much this.

9 years ago | Likes 18 Dislikes 12

it is a way for people to be ok with hurting them. they leave their homes behind because of fear and people suck for hurting them.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 2

They have legal and official ways of going through this. Doing so the way they do doesn't help their cause.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 9

fuck the cause they need to save their lives and families. fuck what would you do in this situation? I had to run away, you know nothing.

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 0

most of them are migrants. most of them paid huge amounts to get smuggled out of the country that real refugees just cant afford

9 years ago | Likes 31 Dislikes 22

obviously some of them are coming from war torn areas, but the majority of them are just opportunists.

9 years ago | Likes 12 Dislikes 26

Refugees aren't necessarily poor before they have to leave behind all their wealth.

9 years ago | Likes 27 Dislikes 8

They stop being refugees when they've reached safe territories and continue on as economic migrants. There's no war in the medi regions.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 3

Why do you disaprove exactly?

9 years ago | Likes 58 Dislikes 27

Use common sense dumb American.. Is it so surprising to see a smart person

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 12

Cause you approve that's why.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Because they posess no authority and answer to no one,they follow only their own interpretation of what is just. 1/2

9 years ago | Likes 156 Dislikes 13

Like batman

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 9

So rational- it worries me

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

And Dinko has already stated that he has "rich and important friends who support him". The government should do its job and not close eyes

9 years ago | Likes 119 Dislikes 8

Aren't they closing their eyes to illegal immigration? I'm not saying what he's doing is just or righteous but if they arent doing anything?

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 7

what do you want their to be done? just let people with guns and hatred hurt and harm people running away from their homes?

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

I get that they don't technically have authority but they just catch them they wait for law enforcement after, said in the article.

9 years ago | Likes 19 Dislikes 36

Why are you down voted on stating a fact from an article? The article could of mislead but a simple comment would of sufficed...

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Police receive a little thing called "regular training". People don't realize how much damage you can do just handcuffing someone.

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 0

Not everything is presented i the article or in the media,as you can imagine.E.g. they publish videos of hog-tieing refugees and forcing1/2

9 years ago | Likes 24 Dislikes 3

Them back to Turkey where nobody knows what will happen as opposed to waiting for Bulgarian Border Control and letting them handle it

9 years ago | Likes 19 Dislikes 4

You can't just "catch" people if you're not a legitimate authority...

9 years ago | Likes 34 Dislikes 9

Actually, that's incorrect in many countries. Citizen's arrest allows you to detain someone that has committed a crime, usually a felony.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 2

When the police take someone into custody, that's an arrest. When random people take someone into custody, that's kidnapping.

9 years ago | Likes 53 Dislikes 14

In the US, you can make a citizen's arrest, where you detain someone until police arrive.

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 3

There is a thing called citizen's arrest... They are detaining an individual until the police can arrive to officially detain them.

9 years ago | Likes 14 Dislikes 4

No, citizens arresting a suspected criminal prior to police receipt is not kidnapping.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 3

Or citizens arrest if the people in custody were commiting a crime. At least it's like that in the US, UK and Germany, dunno about Bulgaria.

9 years ago | Likes 17 Dislikes 4

I think in America though, you have to see them commit the crime, as well as have a valid reason not to wait for police. Also, zip-tying (1)

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Crossing the border illegally is a crime dude

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

people and/or holding them at gunpoint would be illegal if they weren't being violent, I think. Regardless, it's not exactly wise (2)

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 0

to do that, for obvious reasons. Really, a citizen's arrest should only be attempted if someone's life/property is in danger (3/3)

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Jesus christ it's not a tank, it's PTS and it's closer to a truck then a tank

9 years ago | Likes 653 Dislikes 34

Shut up.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

Isn't it an amphibious transport?

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 0

Nailed it.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Thought so, judging from the shape of the hull on the bow.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

I know right! I mean get it right come on. I have to admit though, my favourite tank has to be: /a/3rqlK

9 years ago | Likes 13 Dislikes 1

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

And it floats!

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 0

so did shermans during dday...

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

A trank

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 0

I think a lot of people here are confusing Main Battle Tanks with the word Tank. Tank has always been slang for armoured vehicle.

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 2

what does pts mean? psuedo-tank s?

9 years ago | Likes 21 Dislikes 0

Some Eastern Europe acronym I assume

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 0

"A Soviet tracked amphibious transport. PTS stands for Plavayushchij Transportyer - Sryednyj or medium amphibious transport vehicle" wiki

9 years ago | Likes 11 Dislikes 0

PTS stands for Plavayushchij Transportyer - Sryednyj or medium amphibious transport vehicle.

9 years ago | Likes 35 Dislikes 0

No it's Becky

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

THANK YOU

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Wasn't this guy, or one of the other vigilantes, rolling around in a BTR80 of some sort? I remember seeing a picture on BBC news

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Looks like a tank to me. Makes more sense than calling it a truck to most people

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

Tank is wrong, truck is wrong. Why not, at least, go with something like 'armored vehicle'? Or tank-like vehicle or something.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

Yes this is a LAV

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

I think the discussion about the tankiness of this tank would not bei fruitful. For me it looked very tanky.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

but it's got treads... so by default= tank

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 2

No.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

once again... text can't convey sarcasm. i should have added "/s" at the end of that... my bad :(

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

I figured I should probably respond to this as it addresses me directly :P The reason I referred to it as a tank is twofold:

9 years ago | Likes 27 Dislikes 9

1) Most medias call it a tank so I figured that that's what people would remember.

9 years ago | Likes 32 Dislikes 12

Yea they do, and they make themselves look like idiots when they call that a tank.

9 years ago | Likes 12 Dislikes 2

2) Dinko Valev refers to it as a tank himself which doesn't help the case ;)

9 years ago | Likes 36 Dislikes 13

Can we take cue from the gaming world and call it a "TankLike"

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

PTS stands for Plavayushchij Transportyer - Sryednyj or medium amphibious transport vehicle.

9 years ago | Likes 10 Dislikes 4

Okay, all of you are wrong. Congratulations.

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 3

3) Clickbait

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

So they're wrong, he's wrong and now you're wrong.

9 years ago | Likes 31 Dislikes 12

We're reporting that there's looting, raping, and, yes, even acts of cannibalism.

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 2

This. Media educates people, even if it doesn't intend or want to. Therefore, media should get things as right as possible.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

this is a tank http://imgur.com/faFlkat gotta love german engineering

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 2

"Ya gotta shoot 'em in the ass" - Oddball

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Actually, thanks to the terrible quality and poor sloping, a decent anti-armor gun can put a hole right in the front of that.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Oddball was Donald Sutherland in Kelly's Heroes

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Oops.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Think again, it had serious power plant issues and horrible transportation problems. (1/?)

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 0

The only things going for it were the gun and the sheer amount of armor (though the design of armor was terrible --- no sloping). (2/2)

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

The Tiger II was more than a little better in those aspects, if I'm remembering correctly.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Some. Armor was sloped, but it had the exact same engine as the Tiger I *and* it kept the transportation issues.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Journalist normaly assume every fire weapon is AK47 so for them is this a tank.

9 years ago | Likes 369 Dislikes 16

That's cause they get in dangerous places.... it's safer to associate all with your best life choices

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Oh, a cap gun? GLOCK

9 years ago | Likes 52 Dislikes 0

Bursting a paper bag full of air? PIPE BOMB

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

And every dog is a pitbull

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

I liked the variety of weaponry in the pics. What is the side folding AR/M-16 variant?

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 1

That looks like an LR 300 rifle to my eye, my fellow gun enthusiast.

9 years ago | Likes 5 Dislikes 1

I think you may be right. I didn't think it RRA's LAR-PDS. A side folder would be sweet tho. Maybe an MCX or even Kel Tec's SU-16C.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

Our London Metropolitan Armed Police now carry the MCX. It is definitely a gun that screams "deterrent" when you look at it haha. Angry gun!

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

I feel like your comment maybe had five real words then just letters.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

9 years ago | Likes 157 Dislikes 0

The nerf gun. Gold.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

No, it's yellow.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Hehe. Flintglock pistol.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 0

I love how the actual glock is an AK-47

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

This seems to be missing the most dangerous weapon known to man. A.K.A Nerf guna

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

That's the best damn beyblade I've ever seen

9 years ago | Likes 36 Dislikes 0

What's that bullpup Barrett looking thing

9 years ago | Likes 9 Dislikes 0

Google said it was this this thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrett_XM500

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

An AK-47, look at the diagram

9 years ago | Likes 15 Dislikes 0

I'm going to unironically answer your question, it's an M95 bolt action bullpup by Barrett

9 years ago | Likes 4 Dislikes 0

Looks full-tracked, but yeah, not turret = no tank, I think?

9 years ago | Likes 36 Dislikes 3

It made short work of that bus.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

You can have a tracked vehicle with a turret and still not be a tank

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 0

Anti-air weapons platform falls under that umbrella, I think?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

And IFVs. The M2 Bradley and BMP series are not tanks.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Tracks does not make it a tank. In fact, even things that look like tanks are not. A Bradley IFV is not a tank, but an old Renault tank is.

9 years ago | Likes 14 Dislikes 0

And neither does a turret. E.g. the Strv 103, or Super-Heavy Tanks from WW2 & early post-WW2.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

The 103 is a tank destroyer. Which super-heavy tanks would that be? All the ones I know of have turrets, or MULTIPLE even.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Such as the Maus, the Ratte, the Russian ones (Don't remember the name sorry, but at least 2)...

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

T28 and T95 were classified as superheavy tanks, though they're closer to casemate SPGs or tank destroyers.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

It's classified as a MBT.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Tanks are for fighting other tanks with. Infantry Fighting Vehicles... it's in the name...

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 1

I think IFV also means it fights alongside infantry, or with infantry within it through firing ports. Though even MBTs have infantry escort.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

An IFV is capable of fighting on the frontlines for extended time yes. APCs retreat after dropping off infantry. But they are designed

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Tanks historically are not really for fighting other tanks. The Pz.I - IV were never really intended to fight other armored vehicles

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

No but the fact that they ended up doing so has changed their role, I was going by more modern definitions. MASSIVE changes in WW2.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

MBT doctrine changed that by the end of the war. Tanks are multipurpose armored fighting vehicles, not specialized like IFVs or artillery.

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

To most people tracks is what makes a tank a tank. Even mobile artillery would be considered a tank by the uninformed.

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 0

Or stuff like Flakpanzers.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Or even those wheeled fighting Machines the French made with the cannons; they look like tanks, but they are not MBTs.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Tank needs: best protection, gun to kill other tanks, no passengers. If it takes passengers, IFV/ATV, less protection, tank destroyer or

9 years ago | Likes 7 Dislikes 0

Actually as long as it carries water its a tank. Where do you think we got the word from?

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 1

something.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

By that logic, the Merkava isn't a tank, though (because it can take passengers).

9 years ago | Likes 3 Dislikes 0

I was going to bring up the IDF MBT but I did not know it's name. Thank you frand +1

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Depends on why it was designed to do that, and whether they do that in the field. Also that may be the exception that proves the rule.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

The Merkava needs to take out 40 rounds of it's 48 round capacity to take passengers though.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

Sure, but it's the same basic vehicle. And AFAIK, it can take a few (was it 2?) passengers even with an ammo load.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

No turret and no proper armor. It's just a truck with belts.

9 years ago | Likes 42 Dislikes 1

I think that technically, it may count as a Light Armoured Vehicle?

9 years ago | Likes 13 Dislikes 7

It's not armored.

9 years ago | Likes 2 Dislikes 1

Nah, it just has a metal body. But PTS means a soviet amphibious transport vehicle, and I think @shepurrrd is right about that :-)

9 years ago | Likes 8 Dislikes 0

Tracked Amphibious Transport

9 years ago | Likes 6 Dislikes 0

PTSZ-M is the full designation.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0

or PTS M 10 for the Russian designation.

9 years ago | Likes 1 Dislikes 0