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Jan 30, 2020 5:42 PM
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Huuuugggee
The overdraft fee should not exceed 28% of the amount of the transaction
Sh4dowWalker96
What's that? Charge them $35 for going $0.50 over? Ok!
SirShmoopyofAwesomtown
Credit unions for the win
Jagadid
Credit unions still do this to you.
TheMajesticHarpyEagle
ToneLock
the only solution to unlimited greed without compassion. They tried the concept in France a while back.
IlCastradore
In this thread: one sided arguments on personal financial responsibility vs dick banks
VresiBerba
In this thread: dick customers trying to justify being dicks because banks are dicks too. It's like; I'm going to steal this because ->
VresiBerba
-> it's overpriced and it would be morally wrong if I got caught.
gyuunyuu
Closed an account and WD'd everything. Get a bill with 5cent interest from last period, a fee for insufficient funds in account, and a 1/2
gyuunyuu
fee for the overdraft from the other fee. Stop commenting on how people shouldn't overdraft.
monadi
I'll just comment my experience on overdraft fees - I lost hundreds of dollars and was forced to shut down my account from Wells Fargo ...
monadi
Because they basically scammed thousands of people. My check from work came in via direct deposit. A couple of days go by and I pay bills...
monadi
They actually process those bills before my direct deposit and hold that in pending. Makes me overdraft by A LOT and I was so poor at the...
monadi
End that I couldn't pay them back. Had to shut down the account and was worried they would send that to collections. Years later, I get....
monadi
Mail for a class action lawsuit because what they did was wrong and happened to tons of people. I joined. Eventually got $80. Even when ...
monadi
They are made to pay for what they've done, we still get shortchanged! It's not always a poor person living outside their means.
ZazzRazzamatazz
I mean, I believe it- but what's the source for the 34 billion amount?
Hinahou
Another fun fact: credit card companies make over $50billion per year just on the fees shops pay each time you use your card.
coffeetime
Seems legit: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/overdraft-fees-havent-been-this-bad-since-the-great-recession-2018-03-27
Ogre6
Pro tip, whenever you get a draft fee, call your bank and ask them to at least drop one of them, they are more reasonable than you think
FlameOn
This is the exact reason I keep at minimum $50 in my bank account. Just so I can’t “accidentally” overdraft. I’ve had fees before anytime my
[deleted]
[deleted]
DaisyTeddyBear
I don't get this. If I don't have the funds my bill doesn't get paid. No over draft
rayvn
Overdraft is a credit product you can apply to have put onto your account, to cover any bills that come through unexpectedly (w/interest)
rayvn
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/o/overdraft.asp
FlameOn
Account dropped below $20 in the balance, even if I wasn’t actually going below $0. Kinda fucked up honestly...
lotrmith
If you were charged, it's a minimum balance outlined in your contract.
BigKat77
Banks have always been thieves
Skizzlesnap
Just turn off “overdraft protection” it’s not protection of any kind. It allows you to overdraft your account instead of be declined.
gmoney1504
Man, ppl on here don’t seem to get it. Sad to see all of these “take responsibility for your actions” posts about over-drafting. Have any of
gmoney1504
you thought about or experienced the situation where you had to over-draft. Like if you get a flat tire and you don’t quite have $200 in
VresiBerba
Yes, I have and not once have I blamed my bank for doing it. In fact, I APPRECIATED that I could do it and happily paid the fee.
VresiBerba
I overdrew the account knowing full well I would get fined for it, but that was okay because I got to use their money in return.
VresiBerba
There could be an argument to be had for UNintentional overdraft, but absolutely not if you do it on purpose! What the fuck, man.
gmoney1504
your account ready to be used so you need to just eat the fee so you can back on the road and back to work. Ppl are trying to be responsible
gmoney1504
It’s this shitty system we have that keeps them down and consistently takes advantage of them. We would benefit from better banking, duh.
betyouwontpussy
I understand your logic here but wouldn't a credit card (used only for emergencies) help in this situation? Or if you have a savings account
TopCommenter
If you're living paycheck to paycheck (likely, if you're over drafting), you can't really open a savings account.
ChanceVLuck
You said it. YOU need to eat the fee. Don't expect the bank to spend time reconsiling for you for free. Own your choices and consiquences
gmoney1504
Not what I was getting at. I was saying that the bank system is taking advantage of ppl with fines for something that they offer.
MakeAmericaLateAgain
It is one of the ways banks make money. Sucked back when I used to overdraft, had no food in the fridge and couldn't get food stamps. Pasta.
InsertNameHereIGuess
How about payday loans with 2000% interest while the people getting those don't even get what that 2000% really means.
Rotarded
Have they tried not being poor? /s
JimStansel
MadHakon
They tried and then the bank said "Nope you're poor." Then they corrected themselves "poorer."
skinny87
OMG! Never thought of that! I shall start tomorrow! Oh boy! Oh boy!?
jankybiscuits
This comment is rotarded
purdhapley
TheRicM
Thought she had a rat on her underarm at first
TakeTheStairs
i was shocked to recently find out that this is photoshopped :/ the original says stop being desparate
Isiel89
I have $50 in my savings account now. I am no longer broke. I saved $50 over the last 4 months.
NeoShinsoo
Sorry gota have my avocado..
SquareRootofInfinity
ikr
brendxnn
IlCastradore
Not needlessly spending money you don’t have avoids troubles too. Source: people needlessly spending money they don’t have
Thatannoyinggit
But seriously thou there's a difference in being broke and poor. Being broke is poor money management, being poor is a societal trap.
VresiBerba
Similarly, overdrawing an account and being poor are not the same thing. You don't become handicapped for parking in a handicap zone ->
VresiBerba
-> without a permit and therefore get a ticket.
Thatannoyinggit
I've been broke and been poor. Never in my overdraft when broke but had to pay for bills with my overdraft when I was poor.
Daaaaaaaaale
Deathwing777
If you don't have money then try to invest in yourself to make you more valuable. Read, study, watch videos, anything to keep learning.
dashrendar2112
I wish you become poor someday so you can show us how it's done.
Deathwing777
Ok, what's your advice to people who are struggling?
Timexican
I was poor and now I'm not. It takes a lot of hard work and dedication but it's very possible. Also no college degree here.
Deathwing777
Congrats man! Care to share your story and a tip or two?
Timexican
Honestly it's a slow process. took me ~10 years. I sacrificed things I wanted now in order to have more later. Also budgeting is key.
Zoeofdoom
i teach philosophy and i’m still poor now what
Deathwing777
Well your main profession won't pay a lot so you need to either find other forms of income or change professions.
Zoeofdoom
but i did what you said, i invested in myself and read a lot! like, a LOT. whoa a lot. still do, actually. hmm
Zoeofdoom
the moral is: what you meant was “learn things that your culture finds monetarily valuable for that purpose” not “invest in yourself”
Deathwing777
I'm specifically speaking about investing in oneself in a way to increase said person's monetary value; not just random gathered knowledge.
AzgarOgly
Overdraft is not necessarily having no money. You can have billion in investments and million in cash under your pillow, still overdraft //
AzgarOgly
because of poor financial discipline. Of that billions only part is from people who overdraft because they need to buy groceries.
LarvaLamp
So what I gather from this is "start a bank if you want to get rich".
Ifacatsbuttholeisonly2inchesoffthegroundwhyisitalwaysateyelevel
No because a good majority of those people signed a contract with the bank agreeing to their terms. Those same people went and lived outside
Ifacatsbuttholeisonly2inchesoffthegroundwhyisitalwaysateyelevel
of their means by not being frugal when they should have been. Those same people are exactly the type of people who point fingers outwards
Ifacatsbuttholeisonly2inchesoffthegroundwhyisitalwaysateyelevel
but never point it back at themselves. I'm not saying overdraft fees are good but I signed on the line too. Stop playing victim.
BlurpBleepBoopERRORERROR
“How dare you store your nothing here!!”
Urgentinsurgent
My bank charged me $100 because my minimum automatic deposit account wasn't met. I had started a new job and was getting paper checks.
Urgentinsurgent
I deposited that check into my account but because it wasn't automatic/scheduled, I got dinged $100. But hey i've earned $0.50 in interest
Urgentinsurgent
Over the life of my account (5 years)
flamingflamingo
I like how those fees are called "overdraft protection".
swatz
they used to not be around. Without it, the charges just didn't get paid. So checks "bounced." electric/rent didn't get paid. In a fucked<
swatz
>up way they are protections.
flamingflamingo
Protection for who, I wonder? Bounced check fines are usually about $30. Overdraft fees are usually $30 and more over time.
swatz
Well I don't know cause I've always been pretty financial minded, but I was always under the impression that places charged late fees, and<
swatz
>other fees on top of the bounced check fee, if you could pay them in time and not end up with a theft by check charge.
beelzebob23
That is what happens when people withdraw money they dont have. Do you expect banks to just give money away?
DukeofKMS
You mean like, when they speculate, lose big time, and then societies all over the world have to pay for those losses?
beelzebob23
No. I dont mean like that.
Captainpoopypants
If you somehow manage to use more than you have, you owe the bank money. You can pay it back with the same intrest they offer on the account
beelzebob23
I suggest you stick with stashing your money in the couch.
Captainpoopypants
Why? My bank uses this exact method, it works fine for everyone. If I'm in the red, my card is declined.
beelzebob23
Good for you. Not all banks work this way. Caveat Emptor.
Captainpoopypants
Why can't all banks work this way? I can think of 34 billion reasons banks would like to keep it that way though.
PutThePRNDLinD
[ .gov bailout ]
MichaelAndersen88
The bailouts were a bad idea, as were the government guarantees of sub prime loans.
TatersWhatsTatersPrecious
In this time of instantaneous calculation and connectivity, there should be absolutely no need for charging for this. It's antiquated.
beelzebob23
Choose a bank that does not have this business practice then. Or choose not to use a bank at all.
SurfHill
Banks literally loan out money they don't have to loan, it is how the money multiplier effect works and why the economy can grow.
repurposedschleem
*Banks loan out money they literally don't have. Ftfy. Economies grew before there were banks
SurfHill
Not at the rate they do today, or in a manner where as many can share in the growth. Banks created money, before it was all barter really.
username253
Yes but when the gold standard was taken it changed the whole game.
SurfHill
Tanken or taken away? Are you talking central/federal banks or commercial banks?
DeviatedPrevert
all they have to do is reject the transaction, there is no need for a fee
beelzebob23
Cant do that if someone is paying by check.
DeviatedPrevert
sure they can, they can decline the check
beelzebob23
So then the retailer gets fucked? How is that fair?
DeviatedPrevert
many retailers already have fees for bounced checks, but even if they don;t they have your name and address
Wonderboi91
That's not always possible. What I see frequently is gas station charges. The merchant doesnt always immediately charge you but if you got
Wonderboi91
Gas or something, that money is still owed to them. I see it a ton and it's not the banks fault, it's the merchant
Heavenissize17socks
Heres what happens when banks trick people into thinking they have more money, then loan them the difference at 2100% interest.
beelzebob23
Trick people? You act like it is impossible to know how much money you have.
beelzebob23
Dont spend money you dont have. No trick to it.
beelzebob23
I dont think it is a trick when you fail to read or understand the contract YOU signed with them.
TotallySaneScientist
I expect the default setting to be *REJECT TRANSACTION*
Stife7
That is the default.
Dentistman
.... its not, over draft fee is the default setting
beelzebob23
You are going to continually be highly disappointed.
VresiBerba
You'd also expect to read the terms of the contract you yourself signed, wouldn't you.
ImDavidPumpkins
minionofdoom
My bank charges for rejected transactions....
VresiBerba
Yet you signed up for them knowing this.
youcantgiveAbabybooze
Your bank is a dick
minionofdoom
I wasn't aware they did that till I got a letter telling me it was being reduced from £8 to £2.75
minionofdoom
Also, a lot of banks are putting the overdraft fee to 40% interest rate of amount over or something crazy like that
pjblurton
Then the company you wrote that bad check to hits you with a $30 returned check fee.
TotallySaneScientist
If you write a bad check then the person trying to cash it gets hit don't they, so it makes sense to be charged for in that case. 1/2
beelzebob23
I dont think that is true.
TotallySaneScientist
I was under the impression there was a charge for bounced checks, but I have used them infrequently and am not very educated on the subject
TotallySaneScientist
2/2 my point being there are cases, specifically credit card came to my mind, where you should simply be rejected unless you enable overdrft
beelzebob23
Banks dont usually do the billing for credit card companies.
Captainpoopypants
What kinda third world country still uses checks?
beelzebob23
The United States.
fredgiblet
There's not many people writing checks these days.
valkyrie9
I still do
pjblurton
I write MAYBE 1 check every couple of months. But ALL of my regular bills are setup on autopay, which sends out an ACH, which is a check.
fredgiblet
The only checks I've ever written were for rent.
ramblingfool
Flip side - isn't it kind of disgusting 34 Billion in bad checks were written in 2017...?
KarlOkladek
I think the better question is why are people overdrawing their accounts so much? Pay attention and learn how to manage your finances smh
TigerThong
found scrooge.
Quitipher
Or the banks can pay us back for the bailouts with overdraft fees. Idk tho I'm so uniformed (stupid/apathetic)
ThisIsAPrivateResidenceMan
that was my first thought on this post. people shouldn't spend more than what they have
swatz
Yeah, my ex overdrafted all the time. I never have. She didn't get the concept of how checks worked. It's basically an unsecured loan.
MandalorianMerc13
Yeah... don’t spend money you don’t have and it won’t overdraft. Pretty simple
deathreapper9271
My account got overdrawn because my mom paid for something with a check on her acc and they took it from mine when I had a hs account..
CidColetti
People may downvote you but I mean, really. Yes, banks are scumbags but ffs take SOME responsibility.
RogueMachinae
I have BOA. They charged me an overdraft fee by accident. Called them. They saw it was a mistake. Gave me back the money.
gyuunyuu
I closed an account with Citi, drew out every penny at the teller. A month later I get a bill saying an interest of 5 cents was in the 1/2
gyuunyuu
account and therefore could not be closed. I got a fee for not having sufficient funds, and another fee for the fee that overdrafted it.
CreateYourOwnNormality
We plan wrong, we pay the bank. Bank plans wrong, we pay the bank. Seems great.
AnAccountToPostThis
Or, if you dont have enough money to justify an account, dont have one. What a concept.
n0th1n
While I generally agree, I once got an overdraft fee on an account from them applying a fee for not using the account (I wanted it to close)
ThisIsAPrivateResidenceMan
i have bank of america and they flat out told me all accounts have fees and they all have a way around them. now, I havent had fees in years
n0th1n
Yea, I haven't had that bank in a long time, though it had been a 'free' student checking account. My current bank has never been a problem.
davebeastly
Fees
SurfHill
Yup. Had a new employee who tracked all her spending, didn't realize the bank charged her $30 for the checks she never uses, went $5 over...
SurfHill
...bank charged her a $50fee, she didn't check her account online, ended up $50 over the next month, another $50fee. It's the fees.
ImNotTaylorSwift
With that many fees, I'm surprised she didn't get hit with a fees administration charge.
KarlOkladek
Don't forget about the fee for processing your fee lol
KarlOkladek
Are you saying her bank charges her for not writing checks? Or charged her for having to get more checks from the bank?
WeezyWee
Shush you its 2020 people arent responsible for their own actions its those nasty banks/government
SirShmoopyofAwesomtown
It's almost like some folks are bad with money AND banks can be predatory. Wacky world we live in.
WeezyWee
Banks dont owe you a living. Its a choice to use the service, live within the rules
SirShmoopyofAwesomtown
uplock
Banks can delay deposits at their discretion AND then reorder the application of debits and credits in a timing as they see fit.
KarlOkladek
I'm not gonna pretend like I know it all, but I don't think they have free reign over it to that extent. It would be bad business to...
uplock
Forbes,Bloomberg and several other financial reporting agencies have done plenty of reports on it,but there's no incentive for banks to stop
KarlOkladek
Purposely shuffle things around so that it works out the worst for the account holder. Why would anyone stay with their bank if it's known..
KarlOkladek
That the bank's main goal every time is to penalize them at every opportunity?
uplock
If all banks do it...
Wonderboi91
I cant speak for all banks but I can assure you, the ones my wife and I work at cannot do that
MelodyLightfoot
Part of the issue is a lot of people don't even realize they have overdraft to begin with. The other issue is the banks are malicious in
MelodyLightfoot
their design of how things work and will deliberately shift transactions around to fuck you over. "Oh your paycheck got deposited this
MelodyLightfoot
morning, sorry but it only got processed at 4pm so everything you bought with the money you thought you had, it's overdraft...
MelodyLightfoot
But all that said you're not completely wrong either.
KarlOkladek
I absolutely 100% agree with you. Banks are far from benevolent, no doubt. But do people really expect them to not try and make as much...
notkvothethebloodless
I've been investing most of my money lately and mostly buy with cash and I haven't overdrafted in probably a year
Lulabel73
You can’t give people sound financial advice on here. It’s all the boomers fault no matter what.
GhostGuy
Not spending money that you don't have is a hard concept for people.
VresiBerba
Or by all means, do, I know I have overdrawn more times than I care to admit, but blaming the bank for it is the paragon of stupidity.
TsubakiTragic
Too many people cannot differentiate between 'need' and 'want'. You 'need' somewhere to live, you don't 'need' a 105 inch TV.
TheDino
My wife is horrible at money, it seems she has no concept of transactions that are not posted yet. We have separate accounts now.
AquariumLife
WHAT? You mean be responsible? Absurd!!!
eclectically
I'd like an itemized value from each of the banks, rather than a conglomerate figure. Just for information purposes.
JudgeVonDoom
You can find “CALL Reports” for Credit Unions that list their income, including fees. Can’t recall offhand if it breaks down by fee type.
JudgeVonDoom
Pretty sure it doesn’t so the best you can find is a subtotal of “Fee Income” but just know that a majority of that is typically OD/NSF feed
goodnathaniel
So go find it. You got internet access
Oceiros3301
I think people missed the point that you need some sort of proof or citation to make accusations like these. Who knows if that number is rig
LeChez
Please come back and let us know. Maybe post about it. You'll get lots of internets for it.
imshibagel
As a banker for 5 banks, I promise you banks don't make much off overdraft anymore and they don't want to
chrismofer
why does your info conflict w the fact it was 34 billion again in 2018, so says forbes. could it be you're a banker and biased?
PaintedSlate
Maybe $34b isn't that much in comparison to the other revenue streams?
rtp95
Got to look at their earnings reports, visit Edgar online
SexualChocolates
Using Edgar to find specific information is perhaps the most frustrating thing a person can experience
rtp95
Lmao I totally understand, work in Industry and my least favorite part is goinging through annuals and quarterlies
SexualChocolates
I only occasionally need to look through SEC stuff, so I get to refamiliarize myself every time. It’s a blast
SecondPancake3
Okay unpopular point I know. But banks cannot allow you to overdrawn your account without you consenting to then doing so. The reason 1/
SecondPancake3
I point this out is that every fee mentioned in that post was done with the full consent of the individuals charged.
SecondPancake3
It has been that way since 2010 with the Overdraft Protection Law.
intaglioguy
My bank claims they can due to the way certain transactions are processed. They charge overdraft fees related to ACH transfers even 1/
intaglioguy
2/ though I have signed statements filed with them that I refuse to allow transactions that incur overdraft fees. Prior to being taken 2/
intaglioguy
3/ over by another bank, those documents prevented any charges due to transactions I didn't authorize. Now, I have had to fight them over 3/
intaglioguy
4/ multiple overdraft charges. They purposely have their transaction processing rigged to trigger charges rather than protecting customers.
SecondPancake3
Working in a bank I advise you to review your agreements. The one you signed likely only related to debit card swipes and not repeating 1/
CelestialBubble
If you don't like overdraft fees don't get an overdraft
stankymang
Thank you! Bit of personal responsibility
UsuallyARabbit
Some banks order transactions so that you get multiple overdraft fees. BOA was/is being sued over it.
LetMeSeeMyKids
People gotta eat though...and buy new clothes, cocaine etc. It's hard out here
AzgarOgly
To be fair, going into overdraft to buy everyday things is financial suicide. You cover your today needs by spending tomorrow money plus fee
NoChance16
To be balanced, not buying everyday things like food and shelter is often literal suicide. Not eating is the #1 cause of starvation.
AzgarOgly
IDK how poor country US is. I've heard that people are smuggling to afford decent accommodation. But are lots of people starving to death?
NoChance16
No, they tend to be going into debt instead. Sick homeless people go the hospital and then are charged for having their lives saved.
Indevious
Some banks dont have an option for that and automatically have the fee.
SwiggityDiggitySwoo
it's illegal for a bank to enroll you in overdraft without your consent
AzgarOgly
Banks have no option not to overdraft? Really?
NoChance16
In many places there's no law requiring an opt-out for overdraft so banks have no reason to allow customers to opt-out.
AzgarOgly
Still the customer spends his own money, doesn't he?
NoChance16
Sure, but the banks don't tell you that your account is low, or when they charge you fees. Most overdrafts are honest mistakes, the bank >
flarflarf
most banks have overdraft as a default and hide the option to decline it. None of them want to miss out on that $34b revenue stream.
SwiggityDiggitySwoo
FWIW It's actually illegal for a bank to enroll you in overdraft without your consent
flarflarf
yeah but the consent is buried in the fine print that no one reads.
AzgarOgly
* in America. In lots of EU countries you can go below zero on credit cards only. Overdraft by itself is a kind of scam for turning //
AzgarOgly
a debit card into a credit card knowing that financially insecure or poorly disciplined people will overdraft.
VresiBerba
And even then it's based on which type of account you have, which bank is involved etc. etc. Overdrafting is 100% user error.
AzgarOgly
I would agree and disagree. In a perfect world people spend less than they earn and each paying cycle leaves their balance higher than //
AzgarOgly
previous one. In reality some people save, some people have constant buffer, some spend everything they earn and some go into debt. //
flarflarf
yeah all my comments should be taken to mean "In America" idk much about EU finances. I know in the UK credit cards can charge INSANE
flarflarf
amounts of interest, like 50%+
AzgarOgly
That depends. In some countries maximum interest rates are regulated. In some countries market dictates that itself. Like "20%? LOL, FU!"
RogueMachinae
Does no one have the option of credit versus debit when running your card for checking accounts?
UsuallyARabbit
You don't get it - banks line up withdrawals to maximize overdraft fees. Say you have 3 charges, 1 large, 2 small.
Sprixxen
Not anymore. They were sued for this and lost. They now have to process withdrawals in the order they come in.
Scottwax
If the big one is rent and the smaller ones are minor purchases, which one hurts most if not paid? That's the rationale.
Deathwing777
Put your money in a credit union. Banks are for companies not individuals.
Buffalox8
My credit union did this exact thing to me. I fought it and they quickly refunded me the applicable fees.
Paksenarrion
What most people don't get about posting of items is that WHEN they post is not something the bank controls. If you swipe 3 things today ...
Paksenarrion
most likely they will not all post at the same time. It sits in pending until the merchant closes their batch. Banks are regulated to have..
Paksenarrion
clearly stated posting orders that indicate how they will process them WHEN the funds are actually being collected. Having receipts...
Paksenarrion
of when you swiped is a moot point when the merchant who collected the funds does not collect instantly....
Paksenarrion
The only time the bank can control when an item posts is when it is their own item or an ACH item, which always posts that night.
LanceHol
My POS bank charged me a 34 dollar fee on an authorization that had not posted nor was it going to post. I'm on a fixed income so I am 1/2
LanceHol
very careful on my money. Lyft took an extra authorization they weren't entitled to. Long story short I was refunded but they're a POS. 2/2
LanceHol
P.S. it was Bank of America.
jamesjive
My bank was sued for this and lost on a class action
AquariumLife
And everyone got a nickel, except the lawyers, they got rich!
Sasurau
You have my old bank? Honest, dead serious. Can you get into a credit union? If yes: do it yesterday. Getting out of BofA and into NFCU was
Sasurau
the absolute best financial decision of my life. Also, closing out my accounts with BofA and telling them to tongue bath my taint was nice.
krysber
Same!
NiskanensBureaucrats
They still do it. They make so much money they revert to this system fairly quickly.
clarkWhogotsanity
There have been a couple class action suits over this and banks have lost the suits because of that
Jtwgeek
I'm not saying that it doesn't happen. But it is HIGHLY illegal. Also banks don't decide when your charges post. Merchants do. Most 1/2
Jtwgeek
Merchants finalize a couple times a week. Only way a bank could line charges up like that is if they know what days and times a 2/3
Jtwgeek
Particular merchant finalizes their charges. 3/3
sammyismycat
Law states that deposits need to go through before withdrawls.
HitlersArtTeacher
But even then you’re still using more money than you have regardless of how the bank orders the charges
UsuallyARabbit
Unlikely. Imagine that you have $1000 dollars in your account. You're using it well- but then insurance takes 600 all at once-
UsuallyARabbit
- usually it bills $100 per month, but the company decided to charge you the whole premium. Suddenly your overdrawn.
HitlersArtTeacher
So you didn't handle a different part of your life correctly, and that's the banks fault?
Azothan
I work for a bank and let me tell you, yes they are predatory and yes I hope to move on to something that doesn't stain my soul each day.
UsuallyARabbit
This happens ALL THE TIME. Not to the same people - some random subset that is a small percentage of the total population.
UsuallyARabbit
Most of the time those people shake it off and continue, but some are just on the edge of their bills because of other unexpected problems.
optimisticredshirt
That practice was determined to be illegal by the FTC in 2008 or so, wasn’t it? Wells Fargo and others paid fines (the irony)
Shawnthegirl
Yep, I received some of that money.
seenunseen
Yeah bank of america profited in 2008 off this and then it was made illegal
UsuallyARabbit
If the 2 small went through, than the large, 1 fee. If the large goes through first - 3 fees. GUESS what order banks do, ignoring time order
zenotek1
They do that to “protect” you from bouncing larger items by sacrificing the smaller ones. Not saying it’s right but that’s one reason.
Lostchild12
In this particular case all 3 were bounced. If that's what they were trying to do they need to take a math course.
pygmypufftrampstamp
It's not like there's a person reviewing every transaction though. It's all automated.
narwallaby
They did that shit to me. I complained and they reversed it. I showed receipts for it all with dates and times. Fuckers
fiddlemyhiddle
Yup, been with a few different banks and every one I’ve had does this.
pygmypufftrampstamp
I think it's also computerized with the mindset of "you probably need the big mortgage payment to clear rather than your gym membership"
chrismofer
it'll clear either way, only difference is them making a buck. It should seek to get the most through possible before you run out of funds.
chrismofer
which would mean going smallest to biggest.
JudgeVonDoom
Ehh not really, it is mostly for greed. It is against Regs now
TakeTheStairs
your guys' rediculous private banks are another reason to move up to Canada
OtterlyMagnificent
If I come up there, it's not for the banks. It's for the weather.
TrapsAreIllegal
I mean, RBC and co aren't better, but the smaller banks work well. Tangerine's stuff is near instant for me. Get my pay cheque a day early!
optimisticredshirt
But would you take us?
TakeTheStairs
HECK YEAH BROTHER
roseblud
Only if u can drink a whole bottle of maple syrup in one go.
HaramBe4any1else
And should you fail you will be imprisoned in Quebec and forced to drink syrup by the gallon along with the frenchies
King0fTheForest
I was part of a class action lawsuit against a bank that did that. They ended up paying like $125 million, so I'm guessing they'll stop.
lordstinkynuts
Unlikely. It's a small cost after litigation for years when they will recover significantly more through the same practice
flarflarf
"I'm guessing they'll stop" not if they can make $126m or more by still doing it.
DarkZalgo
I mean if they make $125M plus one cent they'll still keep doing it.
iatollaofrocknrolla
not when they made $34 BILL off it... $34 BILLION - $125 Million, making out like kings
Frankiejoneston
I mean, it's not one bank that made $34 billion but I'm sure they still made more than they lost.
Nekoziku
I think because $125m would change any of our lives it's easy to think of it as a lot of money but it's not. (c)
Nekoziku
That's like saying "They definitely won't steal $3,500 again, they had to pay back $15". Bank regulations are a joke.
CreateYourOwnNormality
I'm guessing they put the following years charges up by about $125 million
TheJudgeHasItBackwards
That's at least one order of magnitude away from being a deterrent. That's easily the cost of doing business.
valkyrie9
How do you prove something like this?
FrostyRaptor
Correction. They'll be careful not to get caught.
Shkolnikoff
Correction Approved !
Isthe4thtimethecharm
At $34 billion dollars a year.(I understand that is all banks) They will just pay the fine every 5 to 10 years.
elganif
see this is why fines like that should be millions PER user. not user affected, per person who used that bank.
StankyPankySammich
The industry made over $34 billion. $125 million is a drop in the water, even for one back to cover. They'll keep doing it, just don't get++
StankyPankySammich
++caught next time because they'll do it smarter.
SnossedAndLost
I work at a bank and as far as I know it usually depends more on the vendors for posting order than the bank. (I believe you of course).
Notme68
I had a bank that specially told me they do that. They said it's what the customers wanted to be sure big payments like rent go through. 1
Notme68
I immediately pointed out how that doesn't work out. I left her stumped, I guess she never questioned the official line.
SynonymouslyAnonymous
Nope. It's federally regulated. They have to have a "posting order" public and adhere to it. That's it. Source: I'm a banker. In US.
retrocosmos
I was going to say this. Deposits and refunds first. Withdrawals and debits next. ACH and checks last.
thisismynamehere
Aren't they saying that, within the "deposits and refunds" part, some banks were being naughty with the order of processing items?
8008135calculator
I'm sure the $14 you got as your cut made you feel better.
King0fTheForest
It was mods like $2
King0fTheForest
More*
abhorance
I liked how you were automatically opted in, I changed addresses twice since I used 'that' bank, never heard of the class action
abhorance
Then one day got a nice $450 check from the settlement, at the new address in a different state.
c00lbeans69
I actually told the clerk at the bank I did NOT want overdraft protection very clearly... A month later i found out I was enrolled anyways
DaisyTeddyBear
Wtf is overdraft protection? Here you have to request the ability to even over draw
3MsAndaJTL
Happened to me too. I asked them why the hell they would pay for something I bought with money I didn’t have, except to make money off me.
JudgeVonDoom
There is regulation against that now. FIs are supposed to have neutral posting order now, or low to high
VesselOfHate
Thank God. Is that federal? When did that take effect?
VesselOfHate
I remember when my bank sent a letter saying "we're going to order transactions on the same day the way we want", I'm assuming that's their
VesselOfHate
way of saying "our customers agreed to this, otherwise they'd have switched banks, as though that's a reasonable expectation".
SurfHill
Invest in banks.
Softbuns
Invest in property
bigboneded
Drink bleach.
Applepotamus
Deathwing777
Invest in banks, but keep your money in a credit union.
Iatesomecoffeecups
Nah just rob them
Skizzlesnap
Tell that to a Bear Sterns investor. You can lose your ass if the economy takes a dive.They still do the exact thing that sank it.More even.
allotherpasswordsaretaken
They actually have underperformed as a sector over last 10 years. So prbly dont
dereklarsen
Technically if you have a bank account you have invested. It's your money they use to finance loans, etc.
monadi
But, what if I have .... no money? Lol, just kidding I'm sooooo rich.
DwedPiwateWoberts
Dang you sound pretty rich
monadi
SO RICH. I do actually invest using Acorns but I have no idea what I'm doing. At least I can do some investing with $10/month.
EvanStageTech
I mean acorns charges you $1 a month even if you don't use it lol. Have you tried Robin hood? If I refer you we both get a free stock!
monadi
Yeah, I know about the monthly fee but I'm cool with it since I use it constantly. Haha, yeah their referral fees are encouraging!
madbydesign
That’s like telling a drowning person to learn to swim. Ninja, please. If I don’t have money, how the hell can I invest in stocks?
FourLegsGood
It's more like telling a drowning person to learn how to drown people.
ILikeCuteGifsAndICannotLie
I am totally stealing ninja, please.
AssWaffle
Rob a bank so you have some starting capital.
AninOnin
If you're successful, invest in a different bank.
ChainmailleAddict
It's about principle. Learning about them and putting *something* into a Robinhood account, for instance, will get you in a growth mindset.
SurfHill
If you had some money to put in the bank, you could have bought one stock. Then it grows and you sell to buy two stocks in a new bank.
Deathwing777
Unfortunately in life you only have two options here: make more or spend less. It's a harsh truth but if you don't have money right now 1/
Deathwing777
Invest in yourself. Read books, watch YouTube videos, do anything to make yourself more valuable. 2/2
totesinappropeseyebrows
I have been doing the YouTube trick pretty strongly since it came out. Can confirm... turned my life around. Now I just watch YouTube.
Deathwing777
Lol, I mean watch educational YouTube videos. Warren Buffett, Charlie Munger, etc.
ChainmailleAddict
All the bitter bastards downvoting you. It works.
Deathwing777
People don't want help, they want an excuse to blame something other than themselves. They want to whine and feel justified.
ChainmailleAddict
They *are* justified, statistically they're poorer than previous generations, but they have a "I'm screwed so why bother?" mentality.
wierdmedicine
Pay off high interest loans aggressively, buy second hand, save an emergency then invest in low cost index tracker funds to diversify risk
wierdmedicine
I’m honestly trying to be helpful, if you have questions feel free to message
wierdmedicine
Emergency fund**
DushBid911
Is it a good long term investment? I've been trying to figure out what to invest my 401k in
realxolican
Little growth, good dividends though. BAC , JPM are good choices. But any sp500 index will have these plus Berkshire.
slacklines
Gasfx all the way. Vangaurd mutual funds are excellent as well
ChainmailleAddict
All in on Tesla you fucking coward
Deathwing777
Who always has the biggest buildings in a city and can multiple money? Who's still on top after the previous recession? I recommend BOA.
ILikeCuteGifsAndICannotLie
Look at target date funds. They automatically reduce risk as you get closer to retirement.
JayEnfield
I've done extremely well over the years on Canadian banks. Have a look at their growth and dividend history.
AlkeneThiol
"You need to diversify yo bonds, niqqa" -WuTang Financial. But seriously, keep some in low risk indices but definitely play around with
AlkeneThiol
2) throwing some percentage into higher risk places or even in specific companies if you want. But even just by keeping a small percentage
AlkeneThiol
3) in like a 20 year mutual fund or whatever you'll always be growing at 2x inflation even with market volatility.
AlkeneThiol
4) My 401K grew by 25% this year after moving 50% of it into some experimental index funds. Not complaining.
warmNchewey
Sorry...I'm an idiot...but...are banks publicly traded?
[deleted]
[deleted]
warmNchewey
I asked IF they were. We did not make that statement at all that they actually were...
Hurro
Royal Bank of Canada (RBC) has been a great stock for me for the last few years.
justanotherprivateshare
Some are and some are not. Some are under a public holding and some is directly listed. You can always look them up on the exchange and see
Reimmop
Type JPM into Google
SurfHill
NYSE: BAC Bank of America
micwithoutthek
Wish I was for BACon
micwithoutthek
*it
rmsrmsrms38
Yes. Or buy a mutual fund or eft in financials.
warmNchewey
Do they have strong ROI or at least stable?
SexualChocolates
I mean no one would invest in them if they didn’t
warmNchewey
I have a bachelor's degree...
servingmytimeinusersub
Not all of them. "the fed"... The federal reserve, which loves when people think they are a government agency, is an entirely private bank.
SurfHill
The Federal Reserve Banks are an independent government agency set up like private corporations.They aren't private, just run with autonomy.
TheNightbringer
Well the fed is kind of like the post office that way in that they are quasi federal. Fed board members are senate appointment position
TheNightbringer
So your comment is misleading as it isn’t entirely private either it’s meant to be a compromise and insulate monetary policy from politics
SurfHill
It wasn't misleading, it was straight up wrong.
SurfHill
Stock price: C (NYSE) $76.02 -0.46 (-0.60%) Citibank today
eggsovermiami
Fuck Citibank
SurfHill
Talk shit about them, but buy their stock.
warmNchewey
Isn't it kind of redundant that we all put our money in one place and then pay money for an investment in money???
TheWhiteBarry
Stonks
SurfHill
Banks used to pay a fair amount of interest on the money they held for you. Today you only get that from holding their stock.
spiffylookingnerfherder
That is an interesting way to think of it. I assume as a retail investor I'll be left holding the bag when mgmt makes risky bets though.
isaypoopythingabecausemostofyouannoyme
Credit unions interest isn’t bad if I recall.
warmNchewey
Ah...gotcha! Thanks.
RebelSkull
I’m 31 and remember when CD’s were worthwhile.
SurfHill
Yes, losts of folks lost a lot of money as stock holders when a few tanked in 2007-08
thegrimtrigger
No one went to jail. And trump wants to unmake the reforms put in place to prevent another crisis.
purdhapley
And plenty have made a killing since they rebounded
hydrationsituation
1/2 Paper losses are not true losses. People who did lose money did so because they sold at the bottom, and many likely ended up making
hydrationsituation
2/2 money after bank stocks rebounded. Retail investors should always buy equities with a long term outlook.
wierdmedicine
Talking the real talk plus diversify
SurfHill
Lots of banks went bankrupt, most non-prefered stock became worthless when other banks acquired them. CEO and prefered holders were fine.
thegrimtrigger
They rebounded because they were propped up by corporate welfare.